Hey everybody! I'm still alive and kickin'!!! Maybe not kickin' as high as I once did but still here. I hope all of you are doing well.

As some of you know, last year I did not have a garden...multiple issues arose. The biggest one was preparations (fund-raising, etc) for a mission trip to Uganda...incredible trip, btw. The initial issue, though, was that the rear-tine tiller that I had replaced the engine on a couple of years previous had it's transmission to go bad. I did borrow a smaller front-tine tiller from a friend, but it just didn't work well for me...it wore me out too quickly. Since then the grass and weeds have taken over the garden area.

I'm wanting to start the garden back up this season but I need a tiller. We've had the discussion of "no-till" before but living in the petri-dish of garden disease/pests/weeds-n-grass a no-till approach just isn't feasible here.

I've looked around a lot trying to find a used one, especially a tow-behind...looked on Craigs List and other private sales websites. When I find something that looks like it might be a good one it's usually located in Connecticut or Wisconsin...just a "tad" further than I want to drive for a tiller. I've also reviewed the different brick and mortar stores...Lowes,HD, TSC,etc., and at DRPower's website. Right now the large rear-tine tiller with both forward and counter-rotating tines is on sale at DRPower as is the smaller counter-rotating tines one. Seems that when "on sale" that the DRPower equipment matches or beats the other vendors in pricing.

As for the DRPower forward/counter-rotating tine machine...seems that that option would be nice but it also throws in more complexity to the design/construction that would cost more $$$ to repair should it break. I think the transmission is the Achilles tendon of the rear-tine tiller bunch.

Since my last presence here I managed to bum up a shoulder a little but I think I can still handle a tiller. An option would be one of the pull-behind tillers which would be great as I could pull one behind my old John Deere lawnmower, but the price is a bit high even when they're on sale. The tow-behinds are on the radar...but just a dim blip. DRPower and Agri-Fab build tow-behinds, at least these are the only two that I've found. The Agri-Fab is a *lot* cheaper but the ads make DRPower seem superior...maybe DRPower has a better advertising person? Agri-Fab *might* be in the $$$ ballpark but the DRPower is not. But really, even the Agri-Fab is expensive.<sigh>

The minimum that I will go with will be a rear-tined, wheel-driven tiller.

So, anybody have experience with DRPower or one of the brick-and-mortar stores' equipment? I'm a little skeptical of buying something like this online...would rather be able to look somebody "eyeball-to-eyeball"...and if there's a problem it's easier to deal with someone locally. But, if folks have had good results with an online vendor like DRPower I could be persuaded to go that route.

Comments? Cub cadet users? Agri-Fab users? DRPower users? Husqvarna users? I've also seen some private-branded tillers so I'm interested in them, too....I don't own a shirt with an alligator on it.

I just need some feedback so I can get something started. As for today's beautiful weather (it's one of the blue-ish skies I've ever seen) I'm sitting inside suffering with either strept throat (courtesy of my sweet 4-year-old granddaugher) or Coronavirus...I haven't been to China nor a major city so I'm opting for it being a gift from my granddaughter....how is it that kids can be sick as a dog and just keep happily playing while an old grump like me it cuts me down to my knees making even my hair hurt?

Anyhoo....feedback is most welcome!!!!
THANKS!!!
Ed (the missing gardener)

Glad to see you back Ed. Yes, the transmissions are the Achillies heel of rear tine jobs. Many of the front tines also. That said about two years a go I replaced my 40 year old front tine Merry Tiller with a Cub Cadet RT65. It has some advantages and disadvantages. Can't adjust the width on a rear tine. takes more room to turn around at the end of a pass. Can't zig zag around when cultivating. ( I just resort to a hoe or wheel hoe when I need close cultivation.) Rear tine is faster. Counter rotating tines do a good job in clean soil. BUT any debris and they clog up almost immediately. I like to turn down all plant residue and mulch so I don't use the counter rotating mode except for deep setting on soil prep. In hard soil or you hit a rock forward rotation will walk away from you and possibly throw you to the ground. The Cub Cadet is a MTD machine as are most of the popular rear tine jobs. It is sold under many brand names. Mine has a Chinese engine which seems fine at this point. Does not need to last 40 years like Merry Tiller.
For a big garden if you are considering a used model. The BCS and Troybilt Horse are good. The Pony with forward rotating tines can do a good job, much lighter to handle but also more prone to walk away and kick you around than the heavy units.
Best advice, If you have a rental center near by is to rent a type that you are considering and give it a try before committing to purchase.

If you find one you like at the rental place, they may even be interested in selling it to you for a fair price.

Not sure how big of an area you're talking about, but I purchased a small Sun Joe tiller last year from Home Depot. It's an electric model, so you would need a power source. I love mine. It cut through the clay fairly easy. A neighbor was putting in a new walkway in the front of their house. The soil there hadn't been disturbed in decades and was full of roots. An afternoon with my Sun Joe, and he was laying flagstone that evening.

Howdy Dillard! Good to hear from you. Yeah, I'm trying to get my hands back in the dirt. How many times have I looked out at my garden area and wish I had some greens growing. Ah well, looks like I'll be starting back over with weeds and grass, but I know they'll yield to the cultivation and vegetable planting! Just gotta sweat a little bit.

I'll have to check around for rentals. The closes Home Depot to me is Montgomery (about 60 miles away) and they don't show any tillers for rent. I'll have to look up some of the equipment rental places and see if they've got anything. Something tells me I won't find much.

So the CC RT65 is doing you a good job it seems. I had looked at that one at Tractor Supply. Home Depot has one much similar to it with a little larger engine...it also doesn't list the RT65 as being the model. HD also has a Troybilt forward/counter rotating tine one for the same money as the RT65. It looks like the RT65 and the 18" Troybilt model both weigh in at 269 pounds but the RT65 is noted as tilling .5" deeper (7.5" total depth). I think it's one of those things where the manufacture (MTD) makes a small change so different stores have different models.

There's also a Champion model with forward/counter rotating tines, bigger engine, deeper depth, wider path, and it's about $300 less than the CC or Troybilt. I'm a little suspicious of that one, though, but...it doesn't have to last twenty years.

Having the ability to work with counter or forward rotating tines would be nice. My old Husky was a dedicated counter-rotating, a good heavy-duty tiller...it would work me hard but it would tear the ground up good. I've got no problems with rocks but I've cleaned out my fair share of bahia grass and roots out of those tines!

I'm kinda leaning towards the Cub Cadet now. It does seem to edge out the Troybilt on a couple of specs. Does the Cadet really seem like it's close to 300 pounds in weight? That seems rather heavy.

Rick, the garden is 1300-1400sqft...about a 55'x25' plot and there is no nearby electrical outlet. An electric would certainly save hassles with using gas and oil, though! I'll have to investigate the rental angle on this, but I think I'm probably just going to bite the bullet bring one home permanently. It would be a 50+ mile one-way trip to a rental center...if I can find one.

Thanks for the feedback!
Ed

Dillard, I'm a bad guy and cross-posted my initial message to the "Tools and Stuff" forum. I had a guy there tell me that he had the weld seam at the axle-hole/hub and wheel plate junction to crack on both wheels of what was apparently a 2019 Cub Cadet tiller. I'm thinking it was a smaller model than the RT65. Have you noticed anything with your wheels? Paint cracking in that weld area?

Ed

Not yet Ed. On the forums, the weak link on the all the MTD reversible tine models is the gear box. I have not had a problem yet. I am carefull with shifting. It is not a smooth operation and you sort of have to feel for proper mesh.

Duplicate...deleted.

Hmmm, I hadn't actually heard about the issues with the reversible tines. I only knew that to have that capability that the transmission had to have more complexity than a standard one-direction transmission would have. My old Husky was a rear-tine machine and I'm used to using it, maybe I oughta just stick with a non-reversible machine? It seems, though, that once the garden soil has been worked that the forward rotation is a bit easier to work with so that's a "plus" for getting a reversible model. But, being a dedicated counter-rotating tiller, the Husky's transmission still went out.

I was just looking at the RT65 at TSC and the Troybilt equivalent at HD and see that TSC charges right at $140 to "ship to store" whereas HD doesn't charge you for shipping to a store. Hmm, that's a bit of change difference.

The Husky version is the Husqvarna TR317D. Troybilt Mustang is almost identical. Yardmax YT4565 has a Briggs engine but otherwise the same.
I don't know who makes the Champion, but is has a cast gear case, whereas the MTD uses combination of gears and chains in a pressed steel housing. It is a lighter machine primarily because it does not have a counterweight. lacks many of the control features. Bigger engine and cheaper price.
Honda makes one FRC800, but it 4 times the price.

For me Counter rotating tines have limited use, because they cannot till down plants or debris. They just pile it up against the axle. Works fine in clean soil, but my main use is power composting.

Ed: Sorry to jump in late. This thread interests me because my Sears front tine rototiller is now 45 years old and it is hard to tell how much longer it will last.

My garden space is 50'X50' and the 5hp Briggs engine front tine single speed does everything I need for a good tilling job. I always thought a rear tine would be easier to handle since my front tine tends to jump around ever once in a while.

I was never much of a fan of MTD. It seemed they were a cheap-o version of better equipment, but since they have gone on a buying rampage in the past few years, they have acquired some nice brands. I am likely to try and find a tiller made in the USA or maybe a Husky, Stihl, or Honda unless this discussion can entice me to try one of the MTDs with a Chinese engine. DR Power always sounds great on their website and advertising fliers but I don't know anyone who has purchased from them.

@farmerdill, which do you think would/should be the best transmission....cast iron with bronze gears or stamped metal case with chain/gear drive? My old Husky has the (now bad) stamped case chain/gear drive transmission so I'm a little hesitant towards those...the tiller was old but had not seen very much work...maybe four seasons of work, the last two seasons in a roughly 55x25 garden and a couple of years earlier in even a smaller area. It always seemed difficult to shift between forward and reverse. In browsing around I see that the Troybilt Pony uses a cast iron with bronze gears and the Mustang an aluminum housing and chain drive....??? I will stay away from the Champion version.

I'm beginning to warm to the idea of the forward rotating tines. I just always thought that rear tine machines had counter-rotating tines. I like the Troybilt Pony...rear tines but forward rotating. It's a little more than I wanted to invest, but I'm not ruling it out. Taking out the further complexity of a bi-directional rotation is attractive to me, too.

One thing that I'm seeing is that most of the tillers are using 13x500-6 tires. My old Husky had 4.80-8 tires. I need to go measure the tines on the Husky as it seems like it tilled deeper than the 6"-7.5" depth noted in the specs of most of the tillers that I've looked at.

Chinese engines: I had to replace the engine on my old Husky before I started back gardening three years ago. I decided to go with a Harbor Freight engine (Predator I think it is called now). It was roughly an 8 to 9 horsepower motor...I wanted to go with the small ~6.5hp but it would not bolt up to the tiller. What I found out by reading some go-cart racing forums was that the engines were good *if* you broke them in properly. The trick was to fill them with oil and let them run about 1/3 throttle, idling for 30-45 minutes. Then drain the oil, refill, and repeat the 30-45 minute run time but at 2/3 throttle. Drain, refill, and then run for 30 minutes or so at full throttle. They said that at the first oil change that you would find lots of metal in the oil...which I did. The metal looked like fine glitter in the drained oil and there was indeed a good bit of it. The second oil change showed much less "glitter". And, the last oil change showed practically none (though still a few specks). I used this engine hard for the next two years and it worked flawlessly and was very strong. Unfortunately now I have a good engine sitting there with a blown transmission so it's not doing me much good. So, if you get a tiller with one of the Chinese enginess on it I'd definitely use this break-in sequence to insure you get most of the metal filings out and help with the engines longevity. FWIW.

Hey @PaulF ! I'm happy to have you throw in here...never too late!! Yes, it seems that old familiar brands in many areas, garden equipment, large household appliances, etc., are getting to be gathered under one manufacturer and simply different names stuck on them...a different color, a minor detail difference and BAMM!!! you have two competing brands from the same manufacturer. Crazy. Our actual choices are dwindling down on things.

I'm glad to hear your thoughts on the front tine tiller...and the engine size. My garden is a little over 1/2 as large as yours so I'm worried about overkill versus not enough tiller. Rear-tine, forward rotation...sounds good to me, that's what I'm shooting for. By now you probably read through my Chinese motor (Harbor Freight) engine experience. I can't guarantee anything, but the one I put on the old Husky is a good one...with break-in procedure done to it. YMMV

Yeah, DRPower has a good PR department and an aggressive sales pitch. Reading some of the reviews it seems that getting in contact with customer support can be an issue and of course you always hear from the disgruntled folks more often than the satisfied ones. But, I'm a little "iffy" about them. Until February 6th they've got a good sale going on, though.

The DR XLDRT is virtually identical to The Yardmax. Essentially the MTD with a few differences. Made in China. The Pony is a good machine. Not sure if the MTD takeover has impacted quality of pre MTD designs.

I found a 1982 Horse with a new HF Predator engine on it. It might be a good tiller. It needs a couple of tires but the guy says it runs good. My problem is that it's about a four hour drive from me and I've got an S-10 pickup with about 225,000 miles on it that I'd have to use to retrieve it with. I'm not sure I'm up to that road trip.<sigh>

Transmission was also a weak point on the older horse models. I had friends who bought them in 70's with Kohler engines. Bearing in the tranny let go long before the Kohler. If you get to look at it make sure the trans is tight with out play in the tine shaft. Of course if you are handy with wrenches you may want to rebuild the trans on your husky since you already have a good engine. The most time consuming part is splinting the case. lots of bolts. The shifter rusting and getting stuck is the most prevalent problem. Second is stripping a gear (breaking off a tooth) and on an aging model worn bearings. Lots of YouTube howto videos.
I hear you about the S-10, mine is a 95 Mitsubishi Mighty Max. It can handle a 4 hour drive, but I am no longer sure I can.

Well, in the back of my mind I have thought about rebuilding the transmission on the Husky. Seems on these it is the shift-fork that wears out, but it wouldn't surprise me if it needs gears or bearings...hard as it was to shift into gear there was definitely some metal-on-metal clashes happening. The season before the transmission went out it got to where I had to physically hold the shift-lever in place while tilling, otherwise it would jump out of gear...aggravating, but doable in a Ringling-Brothers contortionist kind of way. But, last year when I start to use it it would almost instantly pop out-of-gear in regards to the tines. In other words, I could push it into gear but as soon as I applied torque (engaged the drive-belt) it would pop out. I may haul it to the shop and break the transmission down and see what's up...at this point, I don't have anything to lose.

In thinking about it, I need to go crank the old tiller up and see if it still drives the wheels...I can't remember exactly.

I most likely won't be making the trip for the Horse...it's just too far to go for an older machine, though it could be a good deal...or it could be a long, long drive to look at soon-to-be scrap metal.

One other thought, ED. sometimes people abuse engines and junk a tiller with a perfectly good transmission. Going to happen more often with the engines that have no drain plug. If you have a small engine repair shop in your area worth checking out. Here lots of people put unwanted equipment out by the road for trash pickup.

farmerdill said:One other thought, ED. sometimes people abuse engines and junk a tiller with a perfectly good transmission. Going to happen more often with the engines that have no drain plug. If you have a small engine repair shop in your area worth checking out. Here lots of people put unwanted equipment out by the road for trash pickup.

That makes sense. I'll keep my eyes peeled!!!! Thanks!

Btw...what's the deal with no drain plug? I mean, that is really weird but a lot of the engines are like that now. Weird.

I revisted the Troybilt Pony idea. Looks like it has been discontinued now at Home Depot, as is the Mustang reversible rotation tine tiller. You snooze, you lose. Other vendors (who say that have it in stock) have the Pony ramped in in price a couple of hundred over HD. I guess everybody's getting ready for the spring and maybe reacting to a possible "china product drought" hitting us after the coronavirus pandemic (even though the TB models are supposedly USA built). Ah well, The chain-drive models are coming back onto my radar...tearing down and inspecting the transmission on the old Husqvarna is becoming more appealing, too.

No progress on a tiller, still floundering around like fish outta water. I thought I'd found a Troybilt Pony but then the guy tinkered with it, got it running better, and kicked the price up $100. That's when @farmerdill gave me some info that helped me walk away from it. I'm warming to the idea of a Club Cadet RT65. *Now* I've ran into an issue with that model...seems that Home Depot and Tractor Supply carry the RT65...but they carry different versions of the RT65!!!

Maybe I just need to get a shovel and pick...

They may be different year models but specs for all RT 65's are basicly the same. I have not seen engine options. There is a different appearance of counterweight on the new models. may be some other cosmetic differences on the new models. Actually there is an RT65 H with a 187 cc Honda engine bigger wheels for an extra $100.00 or so New. not many reviews yet