Hi Everyone,

I'm new to the site and happy have found these forums, especially this one. I'm hoping to get some basic advice before trying my hand at rock gardening. Apologies for the length.

I live on the front range of Colorado - what my house came with was a yard that was laid down with plastic and covered with gravel. This suits me just fine and is appropriate for our dry climate. It looked pretty nice when I acquired the property, but is starting to look a little ratty. The plastic has degraded so weeds are sprouting up between the gravel. There's a very gentle slope to the stone wall at the bottom, where a row of irises are planted.

I love the way rock gardens look, and due to erosion from the hillside behind me, I have an endless supply of rocks. Plus I'd like something easier to maintain as I'm not getting any younger,

What I'd like to know is this - can I build something right on top of the gravel/plastic? It would be quite a chore to remove the gravel/plastic, so I'm hoping I won't have to. I have thin paver pieces I'm thinking could be placed down before filling in the soil. It probably wouldn't be too difficult to scrape away a good amount of the gravel, if that would be better than nothing.

That's all I'll bore you with right now. If photos would help, I'll post a few. Thanks in advance for any advice you may have for me.

Gigi

p.s. I should add that in the middle of the space is the remains of what must have been a massive tree, so there's a ring where the trunk is (underground). I planted steppables around it the first year I was here, and they've spread and flourished quite nicely over and among the rocks that surround this circle. This is where I'm thinking of extending into a rock garden. By the way, the yard is small, so this won't be a massive undertaking.

Gigi

The plastic is the issue, not the gravel. Gravel is desirable in your rock garden for drainage—no need to remove, you can simply work it into the soil. Could you possibly remove portions of the plastic where the garden will be? I, too, live in the land where gravel-on-plastic is the norm. In my experience, it looks good for one or two seasons, then falls apart. Getting the rock garden in will take a bit of effort, but after that, you'll be so pleased with the results, and if you choose plants wisely, they will mostly take care of themselves.

You've found the right forum. I encourage you to browse through the threads for inspiration.

Any chance you can post photos of the site so we have a better sense of what you're working with?

Plastic would probably cause rocks to slide or soil to slide (less friction), and might slow the drainage process. I agree with Zoe:!

Sometimes we might be a bit slow to respond but this is a good place to start! Since you are in Colorado; cold hardy plants; consider visiting the Sempervivum Forum and the Sedum Forum ! Another good place to ask.

The gravel could be removed and re-used as topdressing if you like the size and color. You could also go around looking for large rocks or boulders to put in

If you need help with designing or that stuff you could probably do it here too.

NMoasis said: Gigi

The plastic is the issue, not the gravel. Gravel is desirable in your rock garden for drainage—no need to remove, you can simply work it into the soil. Could you possibly remove portions of the plastic where the garden will be? I, too, live in the land where gravel-on-plastic is the norm. In my experience, it looks good for one or two seasons, then falls apart. Getting the rock garden in will take a bit of effort, but after that, you'll be so pleased with the results, and if you choose plants wisely, they will mostly take care of themselves.

You've found the right forum. I encourage you to browse through the threads for inspiration.

Any chance you can post photos of the site so we have a better sense of what you're working with?

Hello to everyone who responded. Apologies for this delayed reply. I didn't know I'd received responses because I neglected to do my notification settings.

Going to read replies more carefully and respond. Thanks so much for all your advice.

I will post photos. No cell phone so need to use camera and computer, which will take a bit longer.

It's fine!! I am super excited to see your slope.... sounds like it has SO much potential!!! You could instal a waterfall!!! (Probably over-the-top though!)

sedumzz said: It's fine!! I am super excited to see your slope.... sounds like it has SO much potential!!! You could instal a waterfall!!! (Probably over-the-top though!)

Over the top and then some. As you'll see by my photos, a waterfall is out of the question LOL. My yard is very small and the slope quite gentle ... two sides bisected by stairs, south-facing with lots of sun.

First photo is the east side from different angles. In some spots, the plastic is easy to pull up (in bits and pieces), in other areas, not so much. It's buried under years of buildup of dirt, rocks, and hard clay soil. I don't think there's any danger of soil sliding off the buried plastic, but I'm not sure.

Next two photos shows the circle created by the trunk of what was a huge tree. There's a corresponding trunk remain on the west side as well. The circle is where I'm thinking to extend the rock garden from ... sort of having it meander down to the stone wall. More photos to follow.

This is what both sides used to look like. A major fire one year, followed by flooding the next year washed away a lot of gravel. My neighbor's gigantic pine tree (the branches above) has done a number on it as well. My yard is laden with tons of pine needles. I'd like to rock garden this side as well.

This pile of rocks is indicative of a never-ending supply of rocks. The slope behind my little bungalow is constantly eroding.

I suppose I should add that I'm no spring chicken. None of this is going to be easy. My back needs a break every 15 minutes! I look forward to what I'm sure will be very helpful advice.

tree stumps can be filled in with soil and used as a raised area, with something big on the top, like a red yucca or something of that fashion (or a big hylotelephium)

you can make several "steps" and use boulders to retain the sloped soil, to make "levels" and layers, like this:

(random online photo)



or






all of these are from the web, not mine





I think the important things are:

- Sloped to give depth and best enjoyment of plants
- rocks and boulders staged to retain soil and to make crevices for plants
- provide areas to walk on (to take photos or maintain)
- wATER drains faster
- things can cascade and make big cushions over boulders; giving a look of age
- More natural syle
- Allows larger, rounder, more "clean" colonies (compared to crevice garden)
-easier to plant large-leafed varieties
- show off your big boulders :lol:

Or you can gofora crevice garden style.
you can use those slate-type pavers and turn them verticle to give this effect;




(mixbetween styls)





i think this style's benefits:

- stones are easier to transport than large boulders
- don't need to build a 1-sided slope, you can make it lump-shaped
- more "fluid" or "smooth"
- fit more plants into the space
- fun watching colonies grow between rocks (maybe its just me)
- drains fast
- "modern" looking
- easy to set up... not too much heavy lifting boulders
- recycle old pavers

Thank you for all your advice. The crevise thing is interesting, but I like the rocks better, and rocks are what I have in abundance. I do have broken pavers I plan to use here and there for interest.

I'm planning on planting perennial bulbs in the circle. I need to divide/seperate my irises and that's where I'm putting them.

Have questions ... want to look more closely at your feedback. I do need advice on soil. In research I see sand mentioned as part of the mix. What kind? Is that something I can buy in bags, like potting soil? What do you use?

p.s. in general, what are your thoughts about my gravel/plastic situation? I will remove as much plastic as I can, but some will remain. As I said, it's buried so deep I'm hoping it won't impede anything. I was thinking to put flat rocks over the plastic and under the gravel. I think the drainage will still be okay. Or is that a bad idea?

manitougigi said: Thank you for all your advice. The crevise thing is interesting, but I like the rocks better, and rocks are what I have in abundance. I do have broken pavers I plan to use here and there for interest.

I'm planning on planting perennial bulbs in the circle. I need to divide/seperate my irises and that's where I'm putting them.

Have questions ... want to look more closely at your feedback. I do need advice on soil. In research I see sand mentioned as part of the mix. What kind? Is that something I can buy in bags, like potting soil? What do you use?

p.s. in general, what are your thoughts about my gravel/plastic situation? I will remove as much plastic as I can, but some will remain. As I said, it's buried so deep I'm hoping it won't impede anything. I was thinking to put flat rocks over the plastic and under the gravel. I think the drainage will still be okay. Or is that a bad idea?

As long as soil drains fast and is airy (sand, fine gravel, perlite etc.), it should be fine.

I think removing as much as possible shoud be fine, adding flat rocks might not be good

Unfortunately, the plastic/gravel thing is a cover-up that is supposed to grow nothing. It's supposed to block light and water from getting to the soil underneath to discourage whatever was growing there from coming back and make it difficult for deep-rooted vegetation to re-establish from seeds that blow in. A low (not no) maintenance, sterile sort of a thing--easily pull anything that sprouts in the gravel or spray with poison.
Depending on the plastic and how deep it is--it may not be very degraded.
Typically, what happens is, stuff accumulates and decomposes between the gravel and becomes soil, which is very favorable for seed sprouting; weed seeds sprout, and then left to do their thing, they do that too.

You can do many great things with that space for sure, but if you add some soil and rocks on top in places, you can still only grow shallow rooted stuff on top of the plastic. Maybe that's all you need? I don't know what all you are planning to grow or how deep the plastic is. How deep is it?

Plants that would prefer to have a deeper and cooler root run would not be very happy or drought tolerant. (And, it would drive me crazy to be limited that way in choice, and running into plastic all the time. I ripped out all of the gravel covered plastic full of weeds as the first order of business when I moved into where I live now.)

Also, do consider that whatever soil you add on top will tend to get relocated by water over time to the bottom--wherever that is--down through that large gravel, to the plastic, down the slope and then out between the rocks in the wall?
I have quite a few places that I have to keep adding soil back to.

Yes, because the soil will be gritty and airy it'll sink down eventually

I am not getting email notifications that I've gotten replies. Is this an issue with the site?

manitougigi said: I am not getting email notifications that I've gotten replies. Is this an issue with the site?

Since you didn't "watch" (click the button on top left) the thread or start it, it doesn't notify you on enail
Edit e to fix mistake … watch button is on left not right

@manitougigi You won't get email notifications in this forum. That option is only available in the Ask a Question forum.

Go into your settings and toggle the options to automatically Watch threads you start or reply to and you'll be alerted on your home page that there are new postings in those threads.

sedumzz said: Since you didn't "watch" (click the button on top left) the thread or start it, it doesn't notify you on enail
Edit e to fix mistake … watch button is on left not right

Thanks. I thought I did start it. I am watching. Obviously this form works a little differently than other ones I'm used to ... I'll get the hang of it.

NMoasis said: @manitougigi You won't get email notifications in this forum. That option is only available in the Ask a Question forum.

Go into your settings and toggle the options to automatically Watch threads you start or reply to and you'll be alerted on your home page that there are new postings in those threads.

Thank you. I guess if I start a thread within a forum, means I didn't start it. I am watching because the bell turns red. I just didn't realize I wouldn't get email notifications. Bear with me everyone!

The red bell is for notifications of thumbs and acorns, not responses to questions on threads. We all have the option of personalizing our home pages, so yours might look different, but there should be a listing of "Watched Threads" on your home page. I've got mine at the top above "Recent Threads". If you start a thread, it should show in that list whenever someone replies ... but I'm pretty sure you have to set that in your profile settings.