Has anyone actually tried this?
Making a new flowerbed by eating down cardboard and/or newspaper over grass, watering it, and covering it with compost and mulch?

Yes, many times.

Sorry whoever responded can't access your reply.

Gina1960 said: Sorry whoever responded can't access your reply.

Hopefully you can see mine. Purpleinopp says, "Yes, many times."

Found this older article:
https://garden.org/learn/artic...

and several member written ones called 'lasagna gardening':
https://garden.org/ideas/view/...
https://garden.org/ideas/view/...
https://garden.org/ideas/view/...
https://garden.org/ideas/view/...

Tried and tested by so many gardeners and scientists. The latter don't advice it because it inhibits water movement and gas exhange. But I'll admit that somethimes it's the lesser of two evils (I've done so myself in the past).

Did you have a question about it, @Gina1960 ?

Lee-Roy, I don't understand the comment about water/gas exchange. The physical barrier of the cardboard is a temporary thing. The smothered spot should not be disturbed and used until the cardboard has decomposed. By the time a smothered spot is used, the dirt under the former cardboard layer should have begun a noticeable improvement.

And adding organic matter to the soil is so rarely "an evil." Leaves belong on the soil surface, and mulch is just expediting the physical rendering of wood, which is also something mother nature puts on the ground. For example, if one used 2 feet of walnut leaves, it might take longer before plants can grow in that spot, but there aren't many examples that I've encountered. The soil-dwelling critters that transform organic matter into the "good soil" particles can't just show up overnight because cardboard was laid and covered with leaves or mulch. They need time to establish and then to do their work.

I originally learned the concept under the name lasagna gardening but I've come away from using that because it implies that there are specific layers that are needed. Layers of stuff are fine, but any quantity of organic matter that is a single layer will work, as long as it is heavy and dense enough to block all of the light and be physically heavy enough to prevent seedlings from being able to get through.

And it's not really a gardening method, but a way to clear an area of everything currently growing there while improving the soil in the process - to be used for gardening when it is ready.

But the name is unimportant, as the title of this discussion shows. Everyone familiar with the concept probably recognized the subject right away.

Every spot where I've tried to garden w/o smothering first has been much less successful. More about how I have used this in the past, in OH and AL:
https://garden.org/ideas/view/...

But don't just take my word for it. A microbiologist can enlighten:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

I'm about to try it.

👍

There are many good Youtube vids about it I think I git the gist of how to do it.

Youtube can be pretty "educational" sometimes.

If your focus is narrow LOL. Its good for Heavy Metal and Punk Hardcore music vids though

There was no internet when I started doing it.

How did you learn about it? Word of mouth or ?

I googled how to build a flower bed and the cardboard method came up

The most important thing I think is to have no holes in the cardboard and to overlap the seams well - at least 6", so seedlings that sprout underneath have no way up and out. Remove anything in the area that could poke holes in the cardboard, and any tape or staples on the cardboard. If you have access to a tiller, tilling the area first, then raking it reasonably smooth, would be ideal before laying the cardboard and then whatever organic matter.

If you're working in a spot with vine grass like Bermuda, St. Augustine, zoysia, etc... Going around the perimeter of your proposed garden area with your shovel, plunging straight down, will be worthwhile to make sure no grass under the smother is being kept alive by being connected to grass outside of the smother.

purpleinopp said: Did you have a question about it, @Gina1960 ?

Lee-Roy, I don't understand the comment about water/gas exchange. The physical barrier of the cardboard is a temporary thing. The smothered spot should not be disturbed and used until the cardboard has decomposed. By the time a smothered spot is used, the dirt under the former cardboard layer should have begun a noticeable improvement.

And adding organic matter to the soil is so rarely "an evil." Leaves belong on the soil surface, and mulch is just expediting the physical rendering of wood, which is also something mother nature puts on the ground. For example, if one used 2 feet of walnut leaves, it might take longer before plants can grow in that spot, but there aren't many examples that I've encountered. The soil-dwelling critters that transform organic matter into the "good soil" particles can't just show up overnight because cardboard was laid and covered with leaves or mulch. They need time to establish and then to do their work.

I originally learned the concept under the name lasagna gardening but I've come away from using that because it implies that there are specific layers that are needed. Layers of stuff are fine, but any quantity of organic matter that is a single layer will work, as long as it is heavy and dense enough to block all of the light and be physically heavy enough to prevent seedlings from being able to get through.

And it's not really a gardening method, but a way to clear an area of everything currently growing there while improving the soil in the process - to be used for gardening when it is ready.

But the name is unimportant, as the title of this discussion shows. Everyone familiar with the concept probably recognized the subject right away.

Every spot where I've tried to garden w/o smothering first has been much less successful. More about how I have used this in the past, in OH and AL:
https://garden.org/ideas/view/...

But don't just take my word for it. A microbiologist can enlighten:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

'Temporary' is very subjective and in this instance the time of decomposition depends on weather patterns, general climate and biological activity. If there's no precipitation/irrigation for any length of time, the decomposition may take a year or more. And a year of soil deprived of the maximum amount of water and oxygen is ofcourse not beneficial. Doesn't matter if you disturb the spot or not, a barrier is a barrier nonetheless and it will have an impact. It's like breathing through a towel; it works, and you'll survive. But it's not pleasant and can afffect you negatively long term.

And with 'lesser of two evils' I meant the possible alternatives: herbicides or worse.

I myself have only recently (not 8 weeks ago) tried to establish a new planting bed. It was full of grass and weeds (dandelions, chickweed, docks..you name it). I put a thick layer of wood chips directly on top of it (about 6 inches); nothing green poking through.




Two weeks later the first shoots started poking through and at first I could keep on top if it by burning them off with a gas burner, but soon enough things started growing through all over the place. It wasn't feasible anymore and not very ecological either. So, I resorted to using a herbicide (especially because the dandelions and docks were so numerous). It's not the first things I reach for, but somethimes you just have to. I'm not going to spend hours a day on my knees trying to dig it out....Now it's all practically dead so I can continue mulching.

By the way I never said that adding organic matter as mulch is a negative.

Herbicide is a no for me

Same here, Gina.

Lee-Roy, I'm not surprised the grass is growing through the mulch. If it was that easy, everybody would just do that. If you had put cardboard under the wood chips. the grass would not be able to get through. Lack of rain is not an issue here for most of the year, except summer sometimes but I wouldn't be working on a smother in the heat anyway. If you're looking for something you can use right away, smothering is not the path. I usually leave it alone over winter. Time is a requirement of smothering. After the cardboard decomposes, it is no longer a barrier. Trying to use a smothered area before the cardboard decomposes defeats the purpose, IMVHO/E.

purpleinopp said: Same here, Gina.

Lee-Roy, I'm not surprised the grass is growing through the mulch. If it was that easy, everybody would just do that. If you had put cardboard under the wood chips. the grass would not be able to get through. Lack of rain is not an issue here for most of the year, except summer sometimes but I wouldn't be working on a smother in the heat anyway. If you're looking for something you can use right away, smothering is not the path. I usually leave it alone over winter. Time is a requirement of smothering. After the cardboard decomposes, it is no longer a barrier. Trying to use a smothered area before the cardboard decomposes defeats the purpose, IMVHO/E.

I tried to go without the carboard for reason mentioned earlier, but alas, it failed. I already had a tree, shrubs and perennials establishing in there so it propably would have had SOME effect. Otherwise, you're right. Smothering with carboard is good if you don't plan on planting it any time soon. Any dead soil life will return eventually anyway.