Noticed some disconcerting markings on a couple of Aurelian Liliums today. I'm guessing that these may be viral in nature, but would like some input:

Plant 1


Plant 2


On the other hand, these two adjacent plants have the cleanly-distributed pigmentation that I have come to expect from some of my Aurelians (and so I don't think these are virused):

Interesting. I have never seen such markings on the leaves.

Right. Those last two pics look fine. But the others, wow. Can't say I've ever seen that on a lily before, even in a photo, but it's a pretty classic viral symptom on some other plants. Are these lilies new this year (or last fall)?

Thanks for the comments.

These lilies are not new, but I had the worst aphid season last summer/autumn that I can recall and I had a suspect lily that I had bought the previous year ('Pink Giant') that looked like it was virused. Best guess is that despite my efforts to control the aphids, they transferred a virus to some of the nearby plants. Unfortunately Plant 1 is one of my seedlings which will flower for the first time this year! I'm inclined to move the pot away from the others and destroy the plant as soon as it has flowered, so at least I know what to expect from the cross and whether to sow more seed.

What a let down, and to be on your first (or one of your first) hybrid crosses, it's particularly heartbreaking.

It is common for the same virus(es) to show up somewhat differently on different lilies. And of course, who knows what it might do in altering the flower. Very intriguing, indeed. Frankly, I think the virus pattern on the leaves is quite beautiful, but pretty scary and I would be afraid of an epidemic. This virus (or more likely, group of viruses?) seems particularly vengeful. Could you enclose your seedling, pot and all in a tight weave cloth to keep insects out? I am thinking of something like what organza bags are made out of.

The other thing to think about is that if this virus(es) showed symptoms on Pink Giant that is heavily lancifolium (know to be very virus tolerant), it is likely very devastating to other lilies.

Thanks Rick. It would have been my fourth of my hybrid crosses to flower (I've had two Asiatic and one Aurelian cross flower thus far - thankfully the Aurelian seedlings show no symptoms).

You raise an excellent point about the risk posed by the virus(es), especially if 'Pink Giant' was the origin. I'm definitely about to dispose of Plant 2 (not fussed by that one) and am strongly contemplating getting rid of that pot of seedlings containing Plant 1 (unfortunately I had a closer look at the other two smaller seedlings from the same batch and they also appear to have similar markings, though not as obvious). I think I'd be better off just starting another batch of seeds for this cross, unfortunately.

... and I'm too late. Epidemic it is.

Stem bulblet from my purple trumpet seedling (main plant looks okay, but I'd be surprised if it was just this stem bulblet):


Two of my Aurelian seedlings that flowered last year:


At this point I'm thinking everything in the area surrounding 'Pink Giant' where I had the aphid outbreak at the start of the year is probably infected and will need to go. This isn't everything (I have two other pot/planter spots), but it is disappointing that it includes a lot of seedlings, particularly the purple trumpet and my first Aurelian hybrids. I still have seeds from these crosses, so can start them again, at least.

Based on this, I might just let my seedlings flower so I can see what they're like (and for those about to flower for the second time, the inflorescence) and then ditch them.

On the upside, it does mean that I will have less plants to move when I finally move house around Christmas!

Joshua, I'm sorry about the infection that destroyed many of your lilies. Since you are moving into a new house have you perhaps considered destroying your entire collection and starting again? I know this sounds awful, but if you bring virus-infected plants into a new home you will create a huge problem especially since now some bulbs will be directly in the ground. My advice would be to re-grow all your hybrids and species from seed and buy commercial hybrids again. Throw out all the pink lilies. And of course if you have enough space in the garden in the new house on one side plant all the lilies that you have re-grown from seed, and on the other side hybrids that you buy again (because unfortunately they can come infected).

Thanks Luka. I'm seriously considering it for this group of plants; I don't want to completely start over as I'd have to dump some of the Aurelians I got from Paul (vanozzi) some years ago. Most of those were on the opposite of our current house, so I am hopeful that they will have avoided infection.

As for new commercial hybrids, I will definitely keep them separated in future until I'm sure they're okay!

This is a problem with hybrids. You can't recreate them from seed to be identical to their parents. However you may have 2-3 different clones of the same or similar hybrid from Paul so you can cross.

I have already decided that one day I will start growing everything from seed again, but my own seed that I will collect from my lilies. So now I'm collecting all the interesting lilies in multiple clones so I can make it happen. I know it's not an easy decision, but having everything virus-free (at least initially) is worth the effort.

Lucius93 said:This is a problem with hybrids. You can't recreate them from seed to be identical to their parents. However you may have 2-3 different clones of the same or similar hybrid from Paul so you can cross.

Agreed. That's why one of my goals is to create strains so that I can recover when plants get virused. Unfortunately this is only the first lot of hybrids, so I'm nowhere near that yet!

Just patience. You are young, you have time. It is important to have goals.

Joshua, the stem bulb plant I do think is virused. But these

I am not convinced. I just don't see anything that could not just as easily be explained by other things.

It might be a good idea to start over (virus free) if you had a particularly knoxious virus strain in the garden, but in the end, I don't think any lily garden is free of virus. (Well, maybe Darm's in the Northwest Territories, Canada, because it is so completely isolated). And just about all of us have removed good lilies, mistakenly thinking they were virused, especially in our earlier years of growing lilies. My point is that in the end, one manages viruses, rather than eradicating them (even though that is always the goal). People often bring disease or insect samples of things in their yard or in their house for me to diagnose. Almost invariably, they ask "where did it come from?", as if they think they live in a hermetically sealed bubble and have control over every atom that enters their domicile.

I have often wondered about the vigor of seedlings, and how much of that is juvenility and how much is because they are virus free.

Thanks Rick. I'm still mulling over what to do; I realise I'm not going to be able to keep viruses out entirely, so I'm inclined towards focussing on the plants that tolerant (asymptomatic) or resistant. There are a couple of Asiatic hybrids that were in close proximity to 'Pink Giant' and yet look clean and are doing their usual thing.

At the moment I'm planning to make a bunch of crosses between these seedlings just in case I have to ditch them all.

It would be a good idea to have candidum or formosanum near your lilies. They can detect viral infection.

@Leftwood I live in a fairly isolated place and no one near me (and beyond) grows lilies or related species so it is possible for me to make a virus free garden if I grow everything from seed. I no longer keep hybrids, and they are (in my opinion) the main culprit of the infection in our gardens.

Good for you, Luka. A few or ten miles of isolation will go a long way, but all you need is the right storm to bring in insects from 50 or even 100 miles away.

I am well aware that could happen. As you said earlier we're not living in hermetically sealed bubble. Maintaining virus free garden for ever is very hard or impossible task BUT starting virus free garden is possible.

There is not a litmus test for virus. Some lilies show signs, where others virus may exist with no signs. Whether or not virus ends up weakening a lily, I suppose depends some on genetics. I suspect some lilies just live with virus and are less susceptible to decline as compared to others that may have same virus/viruses. It would be a great research project. When I think of research in lilies, this is the primary thing that comes to mind. It's a wide subject that there is not a lot of depth in knowledge out there.

I personally think nearly every lily is virused or carries virus anyways.

I agree with Rick that the second batch of photos doesn't look like virus to me. Honestly, to me the symptoms look more like something is missing in the soil. Maybe a mineral deficiency or something along those lines. Copper, magnesium, something along those lines. But compared to the majority of the people on here, I am still a rookie.