Dear all,
I have been growing roses in pots on a (East facing) open but covered balcony in The Netherlands (zone 8 b, from what I am aware) for about one year. I was thrilled to see they survived the (mild) winter with my novice knowledge but lots of enhusiasm. I got few more these past months but truth is I am not sure my water regimen is Ok. The containers I have are still offering enough room for one year - they are about 13,5x13.5 inch and the roses are small shrubs. I use rose potting soil from the gardening center, that is labeled as " a mixture of garden peat, sphagnum peat, clay and high-quality humus compost". For a quantity of 20 L soil, as much as the container takes, I water on average with 1-1,5 L water in the warm season. I do it every week, sometimes every 5 days. I test the soil by inserting my finger (yet I might not have the green one;) and when I feel it starts to be barely moist I water again. My biggest fear is not to overwhater. On one new rose I see few leaves that start to get yellowish ar the center base. On an older one, I saw yellow leaves and brown tips/edges. I am very much aware that getting the quantity of water and frequency of watering right depends on many factors. I tried above to mention a few. Could you please let me know if 1,5 L of water per 20 L soil, watering once per week in the summer momths (mild summers, as we have in Holland) sounds about right? Advice will be much appreciated! Many thanks and best regards, Miruna

Miruna, I'm not experienced in growing roses in pots, but, many in here are. Be patient, it may take a couple of days, but, I know others with long experience in growing them in pots will reply with helpful advice for you.

20 liters of soil equates to about 5 US gallons. If your roses are in mostly sun and fairly filled-out, watering every 5-7 days isn't enough. I'd say every other day at the minimum.

Thanks LittleAnnie and Susan_in_SB for your reactions! My problem stems from the fact the the potting soil is still moist (finger test and also by using moisture meter) even after 5 days! (By watering with 1,5 L). Some roses are newly potted so the soil is also fresh.

Lift the pot if you can. Does it feel light? Thats one of the easiest ways for me, but by that time it definitely needs water. Once peet gets dry, its difficult to rewet so I wonder if only the the upper layers are getting hydrated. In addition, if a plant has good drainage its hard to overwater it.

Miruna, My experience in growing roses in containers is that the new or newer ones have immature root systems, so they do not drink as much water as the more established ones. That is why the potting soil stays moist longer. The older ones with the larger root systems should be drinking it up quicker, and those ones would logically require more water. Do make sure you have lots of drainage holes in the bottom. They also need to be large drainage holes, not little itty-bitty ones. If your holes are too small, or there are not enough of them, you can carefully tip the pot over and get in from the underside to drill new holes, or enlarge the existing ones. This is easier with a helper, who can steady the plant while the other person does the drilling. I think you would need at least 4-6 holes for the size of pots you have, with each hole about 1/4 - 1/3 inches wide. (At least that's how I do it). And make sure the surface your roses are sitting on will drain, that nothing is blocking the holes. Also, I agree with vaporvac, lifting your pots will help you determine how much water is still in the soil. Also, there is the issue of are the plants getting STRONG sun (in that case, they probably need more water). Browning of the leaves would seem to indicate the plant is dry or thirsty. Yellowing can be too much water, however roses can shed leaves naturally, especially on the interior, and this is not necessarily an indication of the watering schedule. I've found that watering is a little bit of a science, and also getting to know your individual roses. Some of mine are voraciously thirsty. Others are more thrifty drinkers. It's like people, or animals, we are all different! Also, if you ever want to post pictures of your plants that you feel might be suffering from watering issues, feel free, that could be helpful. Good luck!

Thank you, vaporvac and ParusRoseLady for your thoughtful replies. So much appreciated they are, you have no idea. What started as a hobby becomes a mood setter for the day - are my plants looking fine, I am also in good mood, should they show signs of distress, I pretty much resonate;) In my initial post I mentioned that Dutch summer are mild - and they are! Execpt that these days we got temperatures of 31 degrees C. It won't last, and also it might not fully illustrate te picture I want to deliver, but I could turn this into my advantage. I will add some photos, hope it works, so I am writing this referring to the attached imges. This is Minerva, a rose a got mid May this year. Although she came as a young rose, I've got consistently flowers. Now she is shooting some long cane, which will be addressed after the blooms are wilted.
As you can see, the moisture meter indicates that soil is wet. My finger detects some moisture at about 5 plus cm deep. I am so tempted to water, I even think I waited bit too long this time, given the weather. I even see that the leaves started to feel dry, paper like. Guess what: she was watered on 2 and 7 of July with 850 ml each time (because only that week I decided to split my normal quantity abt. 1,5/five days in two sessions! Normally I do it in one go, 1,5 L). So, how is it still possible to have max level if moisture according to the meter, bit moisture at 5 cm while finger testing, 31 degrees outside and days after watering!?
ParisRoseLady, you chose your words to sound so comforting…"watering is a science", and yes, we all are in a learning curve, and all make mistakes. But to me it is a frustrating guess work and what I am really trying to figure out is what the problem is with my water regimen, soil etc., so that my plants STAY HEALTHY and that I can enjoy them long time to come. Although long my message, I could not take photos of more worrying cases, since I had to leave early for work. With your permission, I will get back, should the administrators allow this thread to continue. Thank you again for your advice!

And the container holes, I think there are 12 of them

For the rose I think there might be "too nuch water" I need to take photos and deliver another story. I did remove the yellow leaves and the buds and flowers that were wilting. But for sure some small new buds were yellow and about to drop, and that for me was an indication I shoukd postpone watering (I underline, that is another rose bush).

Miruna said:
And the container holes, I think there are 12 of them

Miruna, can you take a picture of the entire bottom of the pot please?

Here two types of containers. Water is draining, I saw run off, what I am not sure about is the consistency of the potting soil. I did contact the supplier and they reassured me it is ready for planting in it, perfect for pots, with the remark to enrich it with fertilizer periodically. I could be wrong, of course, it might just be me not able to find the perfect balance, and that is why I am here. ;)

Miruna, Thank you for the pictures. Your Minerva rose in the photos looks beautiful! I looked it up on Helpmefind and this is a Belgian floribunda of relatively modest size, with excellent health and disease resistance. That said, if you potted the rose mid-May, and we are only beginning of July, it has not been a long time for the plant to get established. I have found that the transplant shock of potting a rose can cause various health/vigor issues until it really settles in. Sometimes it is the tonicity of the leaves. Sometimes the rose loses leaves. Sometimes it wilts, or gets stressed by too much sun. Usually newly potted plants don't drink a lot of water, compared to an established one with an active root system. To note also is that ONLY the root ball will drink at this stage, the surrounding soil does not have roots in it, so nothing (other than evaporation) is using up the water in that area. When you water, try watering ONLY the root zone. Also, are you putting the moisture meter in the surrounding soil, or in the root ball of the rose? There could be a difference. A newly potted rose (or any plant for that matter) is trying to re-group in its new home, and there are many issues to contend with: rooting, growing, budding, leaf regeneration, flowering, water absorption. This is a lot to ask of any one plant! It's like throwing someone into a new job that involves multi-tasking; some tasks are better dealt with than others, and doing all at once is quite a challenge. Regarding the leaves, the lower leaves are the darker, thicker, and more dry. This is normal, since they are older. Normally, those leaves will be shed sooner than the newer top growth, they will start to look ratty and beat up, and the most beat up, I would advise you to clip off a few at a time, to stimulate new leaf growth in that area. Regarding the overall tonicity of the plant, you will be able to tell when the rose has regrouped and is comfortable in its new home. It will be perky, upright, and cheerful looking, there will be a new vigor that it visible to the eye. This can take some time. I've had roses take 4-6 weeks to do this. Then, sometimes seemingly overnight, they explode with new health and vigor, and have moved on to the next stage of thriving in the container. I believe your newly potted roses are still finding their way. Give them some more time and patience, have faith, and I believe you will be rewarded with healthy, happy, thriving plants.

Perhaps it is just that the pots are quite large/deep for the amount of roots your roses currently have. As Claire said above while I was "typing".

Miruna, Thank you for the container pictures. There are areas in each style of pot that could use some holes as well. Those areas will not be draining, and if they are recessed, they will hold water. The top picture, particularly, looks like it will be holding water, and not draining in those 4 quads.

Agree with porkpal in that a brand new root ball in a large pot gets lost in the large amount of soil mix. Until the rose starts to put out vigorous new root growth, you need to be conservative with the water, while still giving enough, a balancing act, I know! Also, you could try some water-soluble root stimulator solution, this helps with transplant shock, and encourages root growth. You can give this every 3-4 weeks during the first growing season. I feel it's a good practice for those who grow roses in containers (or in the ground, for that matter). Also, fish emulsion fertilizer (water soluble) is a good gentle stimulant for your newly potted roses, you can give this every 2-4 weeks as well, and even give it at the same time as the root stimulator solution.

Miruna, I forgot to mention that sometimes people cut off all the buds and blooms when transplanting or potting a rose. This is so that the rose will get down to the business of rooting, without all the energy expenditure of budding and blooming. I often do this when I plant a container rose. Of course this is a trade-off, you have to wait for the next cycle to enjoy those beautiful blooms! In addition, regarding top growth, the rule of thumb when planting is that the top growth should not be much taller than the rootball. If you have a 10 inch high root ball, then cutting the newly planted rose to about 10-12 inches overall can help the plant get established. Not everyone does this, but it is a theory out there that makes sense. I have done this on many occasions, in order to help my roses get off to a good start. Any one else have experience with this technique?

Thank you so much for so much dedication in addressing my issue. I am proud of Minerva and I think at the moment she is doong fine. As I mentioned earlier today (in my time zone;), few other plants worry me more. One is with me from September last year, one I got it in June. And to my surprise, it is the first time I read that the comtainer might be too large for the root of the rose, because all I get whenever i interact on forums to share impressions is that only 60x60 cm pots are "acceptable" if not larger. What I noticed when I transfered the new ones from the growing pots they came in is that the new "home" is decently roomy but not extremely. Also I chose sorts of roses that keep a modest size, since I have a balcony at my disposal and not a garden.
With your permission, I will add few photos of the two roses that concern me.
The yellow one, a modest sort, is with me from September last year. She got an aphid March (go figure on the 12th floor;)) and I fertilized it I think in April. She is blooming but I just sense something is off. The browning of leaves - is is there too mich or too little water? The torment that pushed me into weriting here.


No





And the other one, is Kordes Earth Angel (aka Heezogin Christiana). Came to me weeks ago, as a replacement for same type of rose that came dried out during transport. The replacement rose is a real drama (queen). With her I see yellowing of new buds and wilting of the existing ones.



So… what am I doing wrong?

And again: is it 1,5 water too much every 5 days or a week? Is just that I do not have a green finger? Should I call it quits and offer them to someone with a garden (please say no to the last one).

I could not expect such a warm support and involvement. I am so grateful, you have no idea. Thank you! Chapeau!

And to shock you all!
This was

the first Earth Angel I received (not the replacement I called drama queen;)) above.

I could save her, and now she looks like this


So I do do try;) I did use algae liquid fertilizer - I started few weeks ago, so only used it once on all my roses.

Miruna,
Regarding the yellow one, she is currently growing in a rather messy, sprawling manner. This is perhaps a larger rose than the others? You could get some stakes as support, or a small pot trellis and slide it in behind the rose's main section in order to give support, and even loosely tie up some canes. It might be happier to have more stability, as it puts less stress on the root ball. I would clip off the discolored, brown edged leaves, this is nothing to worry about, if the majority of the leaves are good. Roses usually have leaves that have suffered some damage, no rose is perfect, so just get rid of them. In addition, the little tufts of leaves growing out of the base of the canes can be snipped off completely, those are just junk filler branches and don't need to be there. Remember, YOU ARE THE BOSS, you can shape and train and prune your roses while using your best judgement. Regarding Earth Angel, I have grown this rose and the petal count is enormous. It takes a lot of work to build up those very full blooms, and a newly potted rose is going to be challenged by this. I would allow this plant to only bloom on half of the stems until it is fully vigorous. This may take time. Otherwise, it will take away too much energy from the rooting process.