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Avatar for Yohimitsu
Dec 11, 2023 7:15 AM CST
Thread OP
Name: Maxim Ess
Saylorsburg Pennsylvania (Zone 6a)
Butterflies Plant and/or Seed Trader
Wooded land:
I feel a little foolish for not seeing that theres an ask a question forum. I think I decided to browse the categories then got to trees and decided that was the closest I saw. So heres the link to my post that got no answers because it was in the wrong(ish) category.

The thread "Need advice on wooded property" in Shade Gardening forum

Crop Rotation:

I have had my garden for 3 years now.
First year: had no idea what I was doing and didn't keep any records. Was still trying to identify the plants the previous homeowner planted Overwhelmed with a big new house, I spent time on that. Let my garden plot that was never cleared out, but I could tell the old owner had a garden there. My wife has more bravery for wildlife than I so we cleared a mysterious brush pile I was cautious of never going near. In case someone made it thier home. We rototilled it in fall of...
Year 2: super succussful first time serious garden ever. I made rows and planted carefully, kept okay records. Havent tried composting yet because it seemed too overwhelming and too much like boring learning and memorizing. So many methods when to stir it, what to put in. I need one answer, my ADHD brain gets too frustrated and I procrastinate.
Year 3: tried crop rotation, broke, old seeds from year 1 +2 only bought like 3 packets at tractor supply. Planted annuals from older seeds, and had some yarrow, hollyhocks and dianthus blooming well in the garden for their second year. (shocking they didnt get pulled mistaken for weeds) Nothing did well. No compost, lots of disease. More than ever. Im giving in. Im learning to compost. I over came my fear of the "someday will be a compost area" I had piled a bunch of branches there, year 1, year 2 a family of 2 adult foxes and 9 pups of thiers moved into the overgrown garden and they romped around that area that season. I didnt want to like... be caught off guard by an adult fox who's not too happy I'm disturbing the branch pile I havent touched in 3 years.. I got the courage about 2 months ago and Year 3: Composting. Last year was so discouraging. I need to learn. I must force myself... Learn! Learn to compost!! I tried it in the 5 gallon paint bucket, put a lid on it, forgot about it for 6 months on the edge of my concrete driveway pad (gravel driveway) I rolled it down the pad maybe 5 or 6 times through out the growing season. I added some sunflower stems to it at one point and it just smelled so BAD when I opened it. Now I've been reading a lot and trying my hardest to wrap my mind around the whole idea of what I'm trying to get done. I didnt know what was causing what why and why this is green and this is brown. It was too confusing. Too much...like...school..... I should've probably added some brown matter to that bucket (I might have...) I fear opening it though. I'm bad with smells. I know I rolled it once or twice since I added something to the smelly bucket. It's on the bravery list. I decided, having a 25x36ft garden I need a bigger compost than a 5 gal paint bucket from painting the siding. So I asked advice from the community before, and some fellow gardeners on here said many people start compost on big piles of branches so I'm not in a bad spot. Nobody really told me how, but people made me feel better about the foxes. I'm always very grateful other goodhearted people take thier time to read my rambling. I dont reach out much, Im very introverted, so I'm kinda forced since making real friends... that's a little scarier. I gathered courage and began dumping kitchen compost that had built up in the "compost someday" cardboard box. I threw the whole thing in, initially I dumped it and didnt realize I threw a bunch of milkweed seed pods into there, they split open and werent disturbed enough to be flying yet. I saved those and set them aside to clean and store them when I got back inside. It was pretty cold out like 40F, so I wanted to go back in soon, I looked at the pile and said to myself "big pile of old flowers from vases that wilted and veggie scraps fresh and old look awfully appetizing to those of us who arent human..." so I threw some fallen leaves that just began decomposing on top. tried to cover it all, decided "leave well enough alone, go inside." So i'm probably going to add more and take the pitchfork and lift some of it, see if it smells, or has any heat coming off it. I have a point and shoot covid thermostat I got during the pandemic because I was anxious any time I was dehydrated and lightheaded... I can set it to surface and find out if its 30F-125ish it doesnt want to go higher than that because humans arent supposed to go that high. But it should work in the middle of winter if it's producing heat.
I've been going and dumping my kitchen compost and covering it with leaves, giving it a good press down with my pitchfork about once a week. Been trying to layer kitchen stuff which is mostly egg shells, paper towels, vegetable scraps and espresso grinds. Fallen leaves and decomposing wood from my property. I try to make sure its not walnut, if I can I identify it, usually its wood I was working on in the workshop I try fixing a mistake that I end up declaring a "learning piece" that it's no longer usable for the project I was trying to make. But I learned something from it, and improved a skill, so I didn't waste the material in my mind. It served a purpose, not the one I had intentioned. I was attempting something that is beyond what I'm capable of, only because I'm not experienced. I feel like "I can manipulate this like I do other materials!" watch a few videos, get confident and now I have a piece of wood that's 1/8 too small. Make the whole box smaller. Okay, you can only go so small... Eventually I decide this piece isn't exotic hardwood, or Black Walnut. It's going in the compost. I put paper, news paper, I havent put any cardboard in yet, but I've got HUNDREDS of boxes I flattened and got in as little space as possible. (find someone to take them, I'll be here when you find them) If I could just put them in the compost.... I use them to get rid of grass... but how much grass could I get rid of? my lawn is a tiny hole in the woods the trees climb into.
rambling rambling, lots of thoughts but no organization...
Compost: I haven't stirred it yet because people say they can feel the heat coming off thier compost when they walk near it before they turn it over at all. I don't think mine's decomposed that much yet. I don't have it covered. I have no idea what I'm doing. It's right between two black walnut trees but I've been patrolling it for walnuts when I gathered them this year.
So this will be year....4... I'm hesitantly attempting to make compost, kicking myself in the ass hearing every blogger with a you tube channel or website "just add compost! I make it for free it's easy! read my 30 paragraphs and I'll make it confusing with no step by step lists or checklists! yipee your soil will be so amazing your tomatoes will make you cry!!" I'm trying to sell flowers to local florists. It's what I'd love to do for a living. But I cant sell flowers that are diseased. Apperently I have no choice to learn...


So what I need help on... Should I stir that scary compost/ manmade bramble cassarole

should I bother trying to figure out crop rotation for the upcoming season based on last years considering the soil was like barely helped with like 1 bag of miracle gro veg in ground soil mixed in after we tilled it in that was the year it did great. I used some high nitrogen fertilizer in the north end of the garden and planted radishes that were all green and a long thin root. I let them bolt and go to seed, no doubt 50% of which was under ripe when I picked it out of curiousity... my onions I began planting properly and then something in my brain said "wait no onions are like under ground they cant possibly be this shallow" its not a potato, it's not bad if onions touch the light of day when theyre growing apperently.

So those were beginner mistakes but my always bountiful zinnias I never have to worry about were my problem child this year. I changed where i planted them, but they were like a island in my garden of unbeatable disease.

Everyone online who has a beautiful lush garden says "just compost just compost" I'm afraid they may be right. Hopefully my lack of extra funds can be less stressful when I have composting figured out with confidence that I'm doing it right...

If you read all that, bless you. You're a good person. If you read all that you must be kind enough to take the time to want to help.
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Dec 11, 2023 8:32 AM CST
Name: Sally
central Maryland (Zone 7b)
See you in the funny papers!
Charter ATP Member Frogs and Toads Houseplants Keeper of Poultry Vegetable Grower Region: Maryland
Composter Native Plants and Wildflowers Organic Gardener Region: United States of America Cat Lover Birds
Hi! Welcome!

Crop rotation- That is not something to worry about right now.

Compost- Most of us here do it the slow but easy way. Trying to get it hot and fast takes more effort and I have never had consistently good results that way.

Keep on piling everything organic. After 6 months or so, fork it up, move the top stuff over to one side the start building the new pile, and see if there's some good looking stuff underneath. Dig that out and use it.

Don't read bloggers don't watch videos- too confusing and mostly they try and make everything sound WONDERFUL to get you to keep listening.

Ask around about free horse manure - any horses near enough? The feed/gardening store and nursery once gave me a source. I've even brought it home in 5 gal buckets in the trunk of my car. It's the best instant soil builder I've ever used and free for the digging. If you find a source and can put a few inches over the garden space over the garden, you'll have a great start for spring.

We all understand lack of focus/confusion with gardening. I don't want to write too much at once. But there are helpful people here who will answer questions. I have been watching my son with a similar situation and I know the struggle.
Plant it and they will come.
Avatar for MsDoe
Dec 11, 2023 10:36 AM CST
Southwest U.S. (Zone 7a)
Welcome, Yohimitsu!
I feel like I just read a long letter from a new friend. I hope you can find some answers here. SallyG started with some great advice.
Your property looks very nice! I'm in the city, but would still would like to answer some of your questions about the wooded part of your lot.
I don't see any signs of erosion. I do see lots of fallen leaves, quietly composting themselves, enriching the forest soil.
The best place to start is to learn to identify the invasive and undesirable plants. Remove them, learn to recognize their new sprouts, and pull them out when they're small.
Almost everything is bare right now, but in the spring you can post pictures here and ask for help identifying "friend or foe".
Take out the things you don't want, keep what you like. Little by little it will shape up, but it is never finished.
Decide if you want an area of natural forest, or a more civilized spot. You can always thin out the overgrown brush, cut and remove the dead wood, cut trees growing sideways.
Here, people sometimes make brush piles for the wildlife. I only attracted rodents, you were lucky to have a fox family! Now I remove the yard waste. The larger sticks and branches are very slow to compost. The best thing is to have it all chipped, then return the chips to your land--maybe cover your path with wood chips? Some people also mulch their garden with wood chips.
Can you post a picture of your garden area?
It all looks like a lovely place, and it will keep you busy!
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Dec 12, 2023 6:38 AM CST
Name: Sally
central Maryland (Zone 7b)
See you in the funny papers!
Charter ATP Member Frogs and Toads Houseplants Keeper of Poultry Vegetable Grower Region: Maryland
Composter Native Plants and Wildflowers Organic Gardener Region: United States of America Cat Lover Birds
Confused are you in a similar situation, @DavidWilson254 ?
Plant it and they will come.
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Dec 12, 2023 6:59 AM CST
Name: stone
near Macon Georgia (USA) (Zone 8a)
Garden Sages Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Plant Identifier
Whew!
Read through that entire first post!

First... congrats on the new garden.

Second... as Sally pointed out... most of us ignore the pile...
It is a natural process...

Who do you suppose turns the compost out in nature?

I found this interesting article that debunks common beliefs re composting:
https://insteading.com/blog/de...

Re your pile of cardboard boxes?
If you do nothing, they will decompose.

I have a pile of cardboard too.
I told someone that I use boxes to light the burn pile... and was sent more than I could ever use...
To make matters worse... I had someone else collecting all his old magazines and sending them out to my house for me to read.

Ok... The magazines collected dust until I couldn't stand it.
I boxed them up and put them outside by the grill.

Those boxes of magazines absorbed water... and when I pull them apart, they are well on the way to becoming soil, with various organisms and animal life involved.

Personally, I'm not trying to compost this stuff... I use this wet mess to keep the fire under the pot... stacked around the pot, the magazines eventually turn to ash, and gets buried.

Your cardboard pile?
I'd stack brush over it... And then?
Keep adding stuff... coffee grounds, plant debris, kitchen refuse... whatever...

Save the thermometer for it's intended purpose.
Compost doesn't need to get hot.
Cold compost is better from my perspective anyway.
Hot compost shrinks in volume... A lot!
Cold compost won't lose as much volume.

Don't know what to tell you about the foxes.
They catch rats... Seems like somebody to enjoy (from a distance).
Avatar for Yohimitsu
Dec 18, 2023 3:57 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Maxim Ess
Saylorsburg Pennsylvania (Zone 6a)
Butterflies Plant and/or Seed Trader
Thank you so much for all your help!!!!!! There's a home I drive by that has horses Ill probably end up hand writing a note to leave in their mailbox for thier horse manure Hurray!
As for photos of the garden this year was a little underwhelming so I didn't take many photos but I have last year's
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Last edited by Yohimitsu Dec 18, 2023 3:58 PM Icon for preview
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Feb 21, 2024 7:31 AM CST
Name: stone
near Macon Georgia (USA) (Zone 8a)
Garden Sages Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Plant Identifier
One of the wildlife blogs that I follow had a post on foxes today:

https://backyardwildlifeconnec...
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Feb 21, 2024 8:49 AM CST
Taos, New Mexico (Zone 5b)
Crescit Eundo
Greenhouse Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: New Mexico
Welcome!

Keep it simple.
Focus on a few goals, don't try to do everything.
Do what makes you happy and ignore the rest.
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Feb 21, 2024 9:05 AM CST
Name: Christie
Central Ohio 43016 (Zone 6a)
Plays on the water.
Amaryllis Permaculture Sempervivums Roses Bookworm Annuals
Composter Hybridizer Cat Lover Garden Ideas: Master Level
Don't be in too much of a hurry to get everything done at once. It's a process. Change things as the ideas come to you. Enjoy what you are doing. I don't work very hard on my compost - just add yard and kitchen waste to the top and let it sit. I even empty the contents of my vacuum cleaner into my compost bin. Once a year I take the top off the compost pile and use what's underneath. Horse manure is great. I got some free rabbit manure once also and it was great. Take you time and don't get overwhelmed by it - gardening is fun!
Plant Dreams. Pull Weeds. Grow A Happy Life.
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