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Avatar for JohnBK
Mar 15, 2024 9:11 AM CST
Thread OP

(I also posted the following in the Pest/Disease section. I hope that's OK)
About ten years ago we put four Ilex/Steed Japanese Holly bushes in our backyard. They haven't been pruned in years, because we were going for a wild / country look as an antidote to our actual location in New York City. Three of them were lined up, and in time grew large enough to fulfill a second mission, which was to screen off a patio area.
Over the last few years, the three in a row became unwell. Branches lost their leaves. The problem (seemingly) accelerated over the last two years. Now, virtuallty all of the branches are bare and seem dead. I can't imagine that they can be saved. Interestingly, the other Holly, which sits about ten feet away is mostly OK.
Questions:
What lessons we should keep in mind when we try again?
What would you suggest we replace them with?
Do you think trying again with the same is a bad idea?
We'd like something dense enough (in time) to function as a screen. Evergreen would be a bonus. Not boxwood because my wife can't stand their smell!
In the pictures you'll see English Ivy - I know there are a lot of good reasons to hate it. So far it's seemed worth it for the way it hides my neighbor's hideous cinder block wall...
Most of the leaves you see in the pictures are on small trees behind the Holly bushes.
Thank you in advance for looking and for any thoughts you care to share.

Thumb of 2024-03-15/JohnBK/155207
Thumb of 2024-03-15/JohnBK/d37ac0
Below is the one surviving Holly
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Last edited by JohnBK Mar 15, 2024 9:14 AM Icon for preview
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Mar 19, 2024 5:51 AM CST
Name: stone
near Macon Georgia (USA) (Zone 8a)
Garden Sages Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Plant Identifier
We need to know where you are... state?
What your soil is... clay?

To me... It looks like the plants are very close to the concrete.
The fact that they got that large before dying... suggests that the bush was probably fine to plant... Reminds me of shrubs that eventually give up because there's issues with the root zone.

I personally would suggest something native... consider wax myrtle, and yaupon holly. Plant a little further from the concrete, and dig a wide hole.
Avatar for CalPolygardener
Mar 19, 2024 7:26 AM CST
California (Zone 9b)
Maybe some close-ups of the leaves and stems could help.
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Mar 19, 2024 12:23 PM CST
Northern NJ (Zone 7a)
New York City is mentioned in the post.

I also think they are too close to the masonry there and I wonder what is beneath the soil and what was left behind. I am guessing there is a foundation under the stonework. I would have the soil tested. Japanese holly like conditions on the acidic side and maybe because of the stonework, the spot is alkaline. Contact your local extension center for a soil test.

Also, we had two years of high temps and droughty summers. That did one of my Japanese shrubs in after having it for many years. Yours had additional heat reflected/conducted from the stonework.

A lot of broadleaf evergreens do prefer more acidic conditions so maybe at least plant it a few feet from the masonry if you have the room. Yews are more tolerant of a range of PH.

Cornel Cooperative Extension - New York City - 212 340 2910, supposedly they have locations in the 5 boroughs.
https://cals.cornell.edu/corne...
Last edited by LorettaNJ Mar 19, 2024 12:26 PM Icon for preview
Avatar for JohnBK
Mar 22, 2024 7:56 AM CST
Thread OP

To @stone and @LorettaNJ - THANK YOU! This is all very helpful! I am mostly concerned to not repeat our experience of bush failure, and you've given me some tools - things to explore so that our next attempt has a better chance to live a full life. We all want that!
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Mar 22, 2024 8:28 PM CST
Northern NJ (Zone 7a)
You're welcome. And as the saying goes, to become a good gardener, you got to kill a lot of plants. Or something like that.
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Mar 23, 2024 5:28 AM CST
Name: stone
near Macon Georgia (USA) (Zone 8a)
Garden Sages Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Plant Identifier
JohnBK said: I am mostly concerned to not repeat our experience of bush failure, and you've given me some tools - things to explore...

I didn't see answers to my questions....

It's going to be difficult to get solutions without being forthcoming.

What ever shrub(s) you eventually purchase, are going to have to be able to tolerate whatever conditions you have...

here are several plant lists from your local extension service...
Maybe they will help:
https://gardening.cals.cornell...
Last edited by stone Mar 23, 2024 6:03 AM Icon for preview
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Mar 23, 2024 12:30 PM CST
Northern NJ (Zone 7a)
One thing I would add is think of the mature size of the shrub you decide to plant. Use the stem as a center point and move your shrub away from the patio by 1/2 the width at least.
Avatar for JohnBK
Mar 24, 2024 9:42 AM CST
Thread OP

I apologize @stone for not responding more clearly. I'm in New York City - Brooklyn to be exact, for what that is worth as the climate/zones sure seem to be migrating north pretty rapidly! I don't know what kind of soil we have back there - but will figure out what "kind" it is as well as testing for ph. And thanks - going forward I will definitely check out wax myrtle and yaupon holly. Also the consensus view here that we should be planting further from the concrete!

@LorettaNJ - thanks for the referral to the extension service, which I will definitely contact, and have a fond feeling for because my mom went to the Cornell Ag school many years ago. Later in her life, after doing other things, she had a big Bio-Dynamic herb garden from which she sold many seedlings - her plant grandchildren live on around Massachusetts.
Avatar for MysTerryGardens
Mar 27, 2024 12:50 PM CST
Name: Terry
Upstate New York, USA (Zone 6a)
Pardon my ignorance; here to learn.
Hi!
Holly bushes like acid, and all the lime from cement probably means you have alkaline soil. Maybe some soil amendments or acid plant food...
Good luck!
I appreciate your knowledge and opinions.
Avatar for Frillylily
Apr 4, 2024 1:11 PM CST
Missouri (Zone 6a)
I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Identifier
Not all boxwoods smell, there are newer kind that don't,and also new varieties now that are resistant to boxwood blight.
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