Bob, you are also an enabler--you just enabled me to order Fragrant Cloud honeysuckle. Now all I have to do is find the right place to plant it, but that will be fun to do, there are several possibilities where it should work just fine. I really like the idea that it is supposed to flower right down to the ground. Now, it's on the clematis , and the arduous task of selecting just two out of so many beauties--a tough job but somebody has to do it