Sorry to hear about the aphids, Zen. I don't breed zinnias, I just enjoy seeing your original creations and I look forward to future wonders. Usually I toss some seeds into the garden because I love the critters they attract, but they don't sprout outside until it gets good and warm. Flowers usually appear mid-June. How I wish I could successfully sow them in March or April!

Katydids are primarily leaf-eaters, although they do munch on an occasional bug if they can catch one. . .they are cousins to grasshoppers but not nearly as fast or voracious or numerous in my experience. I don't have the species that sing, but they get huge here. Here's one on a zinnia and some other zin guests! (sorry, always looking for an excuse to post pictures of critters )

ZenMan said: Hello Evelyn and Zoë,
The last time I tried to "pet" a Praying Mantis in my garden, it attacked me! Our size difference didn't seem to matter to it.

ZM ~ She probably thought you were attacking her.

ZenMan said:
"I guess I should start them a bit earlier, huh? Like in March or April?"
You could start them indoors in little pots, but unless you are trying to get two generations outside, you could just plant their seeds directly in ground in your garden after there is no danger of frost. My main plantings are in ground because that is so much less trouble and makes it practical to plant a lot of them.

Thank you, ZM.

ZenMan said:]This is a photo of a young katydid on one of my zinnia blooms.

ZM ~ Oh, that one is so pretty. I just love the color blending! (The zinnia, not the katydid!)

ZenMan said: More later.

ZM

Hello Zoë,

" Katydids are primarily leaf-eaters, although they do munch on an occasional bug if they can catch one. "

This reference says that Katydids are primarily carnivorous.

https://feedingnature.com/what...

Notice that the zinnia in your Katydid photo hasn't been chewed on. I have seen a lot of Katydids on my zinnias, but never any evidence that they have taken even one bite out of a zinnia bloom, or zinnia foliage. I have never seen a Katydid eating any kind of foliage. So I don't consider Katydids to be a "bad" insect. I do consider Grasshoppers to be bad. Apparently, there is a difference of opinion as to whether Katydids are herbivorous or carnivorous.

ZM

Zen, it might not be opinion, rather species. I can assure you that the katydids I have (Microcentrum rhombifolium, Broad-winged katydid). eat leaves in my garden. They particularly loved a buddleia I had several years ago.

But with utmost respect, I question the credibility of that article you linked. The author is an "Amazon Associate ' with no listed credentials and offers no cites. The first photo captioned "Katydid eating leaf" is clearly a grasshopper. I don't question that some katydid species (there are hundreds) eat some insects, but most credible sources say they are primarily herbivorous.

Here is an excerpt from the article linked below it
"Like other Orthoptera, katydids have chewing mouthparts, and most are herbaceous but rarely cause significant plant damage to crops or ornamental plants. You may find some feeding on leaves and flowers in your garden or on your potted plants, especially in late summer. Some, especially in the tropics, are predaceous, feeding on other insects or eggs."
https://hort.extension.wisc.ed...

Also, from http://www.biokids.umich.edu/c...

"What do they eat?
Katydids are primarily leaf-eaters. They sometimes eat other plant parts (especially flowers). They also sometimes eat dead insects, insect eggs or slow-moving insects like aphids. In the tropics some species are quite carnivorous.

I'm not trying to pick an argument here, but I've researched these insects in my garden before and knew them to chew leaves. You might have a different species.

I have to ditto Zoe. And add that the pictured grasshopper is an herbivore.

Hello Zoë,

That link does have its problems. That first picture is of a grasshopper. I don't know that being an Amazon Associate discredits you as knowing anything, but I concede that that link oversells the carnivorous aspect of the katydid diet. This is a different what-do-katydids-eat link:

https://imp.world/animals/what...

There are supposedly 255 species of Katydids in North America, and thousands worldwide. I don't know how many Katydid species we have here in Kansas. I frequently see Katydids on my zinnias, and I have never seen one take a bite out of any part of a zinnia plant. I have seen Katydids eating small insects off of my zinnias, consisting of aphids and other small insects, and once a small flower spider. So as far as I am concerned, the Katydids in this part of Kansas are beneficial. At least, slightly beneficial to my zinnias. I have no idea what they are eating when I am not watching them. Possibly tree leaves or parts of some of our many native plants. I agree that Katydids are not exclusively carnivores, but are probably omnivores. I do enjoy their evening songs.

"You might have a different species."

Based on different appearances, I have at least two, and possibly three, or more different species of Katydids. Part of their diversity may be significant differences between katydid males and females.

Anyway, I don't think we have any serious disagreements on Katydids.

ZM

All is good Zen. Agree, nothing serious. I'm glad yours aren't as herbivorous as mine!

edit to add - hahaha, they DO especially like Buddleia. I'm telling ya they shredded mine!

From your link, about food preferences:
Leaves: by far the katydid's favorite food. A few of their favorite types include: eucalyptus, angophora, bursaria, acacia, alpinia, flax lilies, citrus, oak, bramble, hazel, hypericum, and butterfly bush

Hello Zoë,

" I'm glad yours aren't as herbivorous as mine! "

Well, actually I have never seen Katydids eating any foliage. At least, not yet. That is why I had the wrong idea that Katydids were carnivores! And I seem to recall seeing that statement (that Katydids are carnivores) in a book somewhere. I may look for that reference when I have some spare time. So next year I will try to catch Katydids doing something in the way of eating foliage or some plant part. But I won't hurt them even if I do catch them doing something herbivorous. (Unless they are eating a prize zinnia.)

ZM

Agreed. No point in senseless insect eradication.

Hello all,

This was another example of a tubular petal having reasonably good white color on the outside of the tube.

That specimen occurred several years ago and apparently, I didn't save seeds from it specifically. The stigmas are inside the tubes and in order to fertilize them you need to open the tube up in one way or another. Early on I was rather timid about surgically modifying my blooms, so that bloom may not have even set seeds. Currently I usually just break or cut the tubes off near the base to expose their stigma. Hopefully, I will get some good outside white colorations with some of my contemporary specimens. Nowadays I won't be timid about opening them up to expose their stigmas for fertilization.

ZM

ZM ~ How unique! Keep up the good work, and thank you for sharing your results with us.

Hello again, everyone,

Glad to be over some of my wrong thinking on what katydids eat. I concede that many katydids eat plant leaves, even though I have not seen them do it. And at least a few are carnivorous.

I am an apartment dweller now, so there are no katydids (or grasshoppers) here. Back to the tubular-petalled zinnia subject. Even though I can grow only a limited number of zinnias here in and around the apartment, I am still interested in variations of the tubular petals in zinnias. One variation is a closed-end tube that I have referred to by the odd name of "woolly" because they remind me of sheep.



Some of the "Woolies" have closed-end tubular petals that never open, while others have closed-petal ends that can, under some circumstances, open on their own. Their decorative value is open to question, but at least they are "different" and can give interesting results when crossed with other zinnias. I am always looking for different results.

ZM

ZM ~ Are you now growing zinnias inside your apartment, or do you have a patio or lanai?

Hi Evelyn,

"Are you now growing zinnias inside your apartment...?"

I am growing zinnias in the apartment. I actually have some second-generation seedlings growing now. There is a small space near our small apartment patio where I can probably plant some zinnias when the weather gets warmer here in Kansas. These are some more photos of the "Woolies" I mentioned. Their petals are like solid objects.



I think they have potential when crossed with other breeder zinnia specimens.

Incidentally these "normal" in-line photos are already reasonably large. Still, you can see an even larger version by clicking on them, and you can close that enlargement by clicking on the X in the lower right-hand corner.

ZM

Wow! Those are really awesome! Nice work!

ZM, your Zinnias are so beautiful, and I know you are extremely busy with the breeding process of those Zinnias, but in your copious free time could you please post some photos of your work.

I grow a few here in central Florida, but mostly in containers to prevent rabbit devastation. Keep up the great work and keep those lovely pics coming when you can.

Hi slowcala,

"...could you please post some photos of your work"

Besides washing pots and trays, the main thing that I do is cross-pollinate zinnias. I do that much better than bees or butterflies because I take pollen from specific zinnias and place it on specific zinnias, and I keep records. There are many "tools" that can prove useful in that regard. I can actually do pollination with just my fingers (thumb and forefinger). Still, I find it a bit more convenient to use Kelly forceps or tweezers to "pick" a floret and rub it on stigmas of the "female" zinnia. I have several different tweezers and forceps of slightly different designs and my "favorites" change from time to time.


I have several pairs of small Kelly forceps and several tweezers of slightly different designs. They are more of a convenience than a necessity, but cross-pollinating is where the magic happens.

ZM

Thank you ZM!

Hi guys,

Tubular zinnia petals come in many variations besides that odd "woolly" configuration. Some of the straight tubular forms look better to me.



A potential disadvantage of tubular petals is that the front-side color becomes the inside color, and the normally dull backside color becomes the primarily visible color, with just a peak at the inside color through the open end of the tube. Also, the stigma is inside the tube. Apparently, a few rare tubes also have internal anthers that can pollinate the internal stigma. Fortunately, florets on tubular blooms ensure at least some fertile seeds.

ZM

Isn't that a beauty?