If the original sender did not want them back you could always post a list of what was unclaimed and ask if any of the other participants wanted to claim them.

Don't need to reinvent the wheel, the way its been done in other swaps is the central person collects all the seeds. Participants indicate if they want extra bonus seeds. Everyone who sends in gets their requests. If they don't send in they don't get seeds. Those who indicate they will accept bonus seeds gets the extras.
As for timing, we all have seeds collected now. We can do the swapping in November then have seeds sent out in January, it takes a while to get them all mailed in and divided. In time for zone 7 and above, which is not just the south but includes Long Island NY. National Seed Swap day is the last Saturday in January, which is when I'm doing a local swap. If swap is done so late in season will lose a lot of us zone 7 plus. In the end whoever is doing labor will do how they see fit, but I'm sharing my experience of what worked in other swaps.

bxncbx said:When I did the piggy swap last year everyone had their own page with a basic form where they listed what they had to offer. Besides the name of the plant and the variety you could also include seed source (garden or commercial), seed age, number of seeds per packet & number of packets offered

We each have our own "Plant List" on our profile page here on ATP, maybe we need an "Available Seed List" as well.

plantladylin said:
We each have our own "Plant List" on our profile page here on ATP, maybe we need an "Available Seed List" as well.

I love the idea! That may come about as a result of all of this.

One thing people have reminded me, though, is that many people don't keep their plant lists up to date.

I don't

I would be interested in participating.

My dinosaur computer won't go above IE7, and has had trouble with some spread sheets.

Could we ask that packets be dated according to year harvested in a garden or year the commercial vendor packet it for?

I like the idea of a trade list associated with our profile pages, as well as putting up the lists by year's end and trading in January - it works better for winter sowing. Would also love to see a trading database, where each trader could have a database linked to an overal search feature.

Speaking of keeping things easier on the host, would we want to set a limit of how many packets each trader could acquire (That might simplify matters of postage, as well as make distribution of seeds more even) ? Would it be helpful for the host if we packed our seeds individually before sending them in, with the understanding that the host might need to repackage at some point? Shall we ask traders to put their screen names on the packets they send in, to help prevent getting seeds back that they send in and to help host keep distribution even?

I don't keep my trade list updated either , but like to create one for each swap I enter and make up packets ahead of time accordingly

Wishing everyone good luck with this swap.

ps - I try to build part of my trade list on everyone else's wish lists, so if we do a database for each trader, this would be a great place to put it.

I don't have time to maintain a big trade list; it's just not practical for me, but will tailor make one for the swap. As bluespiral suggests, I make an effort to keep wish lists in mind when I prepare a list for a particular swap event.
I do hope this goes forward. There is a scarcity of swaps this year and this one could establish a fun annual event for ATP.

OK, I have talked myself into it. If everyone is ok with it, I am willing to organize the swap and be the central clearing house for the seeds if nobody else wants it.

LoL, Jay! I had gotten to thinking of taking on the craziness the first year to get it going and so that I could see what obstacles come up for the 'warehouse' person so that I could devise ways to fix it for the future. If you really wanted to do it the first year, though, that might work out. I'm in the middle of communicating with Dave about some of the behind-the-scene details. If I end up feeling pretty confident about it when all is said and done, I'll hand off the responsibility to you (assuming you still want it).

Hurray for Jay and DogsNDaylilies!


I like the idea of adding optional Wish Lists. We all have many more seeds than we feel like typing into a swap list. Half the pleasure of a trade is giving someone something they REALLY want.
A Wish List lets the person who wants something "pull" it out of obscurity in someone else's seed stash.


>> Could we ask that packets be dated according to year harvested in a garden or year the commercial vendor packet it for?

I would suggest REQUESTING some basic info on each seed label, but many people would rather not write much. I find it helps to have access to a laser printer for fine print! (My handwriting STINKS.)


I would request six to eight things, but expect to get 2-3 things.

common name of seed + cultivar variety if you know it + Latin name if you know it
bloom color
year harvested or year on commercial seed pkt (which means less each year from some seed vendors)
commercial or harvested or received in trade .
Isolated or not, from cross-pollination.
cultivation and germination notes if you like that.
from whom (this lets them still know who it came from years later, even after re-trading.)

About cross-pollination, you can just say "ex Plant Name" meaning you collected FROM that plant, but the pollen came from wherever it came from. That works great for lettuce and tomatoes, less so for Brassicas.

I will certainly participate as a member, but not as the central person. If there are ways I can help, I would love to help.

>> Each person was responsible for editing their post to add the names of people who wanted their seeds.

Unless Dave thinks of some interactive feature, that sounds like a good plan. The person holding the seeds makes the final decision to send someone a packet, so that person is the logical one to add the info "I agree to send 20 ABC seeds to Person 3".

It seems desirable that each participant should do as much of the work of documenting what was agreed to, as possible. The format they should record these in, should probably be designed to make life easier for the central person.

It might be great if the people trading could do all the discussing and agreeing and documenting and sorting ... then the central person could just transfer bundles of seeds from the "FROM" mailers into the "TO" mailers without taking responsibility for checking the consistency of various documents and the contents of what came in.

I wonder whether most trades will be 1-to-1 trades or gifts? In the Piggy Swap, everyone GOT a lot of seeds, and GAVE a lot of seeds, and didn't worry too much whether they were "coming out ahead or behind". I'm thinking that many participants will be willing to give away common seeds as long as there are other good seeds coming their way from SOMEONE.

Perhaps people with rarer seeds will want to get something specific back before agreeing to trade or gift - it sounds like the OP's idea would allow that. It would be up to the person agreeing to the trade or to the gift - what the Piggy Swap calls an "oink".


I think it's genius to DISPLAY the lists of who-gets-what online. If someone asked for some free rare seeds from me that I had hand-carried back from a family farm on the slopes of Mount Inaccessible, I would check their database. If they had already agreed to give gifts to 20 people, they would get my rare seeds for free. If they have more "asks" than "offers", maybe not.

Like Alana, I've been participating in group trades/swaps just like this for at least a decade and they can be a lot of fun. Since there is already a lot of experience in this type of trade, a lot of the issues/obstacles are already known. I've never hosted one myself, though. If we could find someone who has hosted several swaps, they would be a good source of info. If we can't, however, I think there are enough people on ATP that have participated in group seed swaps that we could cobble together a lot of the information between us.

I think having an ATP seed swap would be a great idea and might attract new members. Gardenweb members hosted a lot of group trades until recently when Houzz took over. Most of the good traders have left and now most posts are just people trying to sponge free seeds off of good-hearted people. If we could attract more of those fabulous traders/gardeners, that would be wonderful. (Thankfully, some of those lovely people are already ATP members. )

I've had a rubbish year as far as gardening and seed collecting so I'm not sure if I'll participate yet but I can try to help with some info, at least.

Here's a start of some info that might be helpful:

The host needs to be a known, trustworthy person. You don't want a scammer who will keep all the seeds and postage money for themselves.

Seeds need to be mailed in a bubble envelope or a box. Bubble wrap in a regular envelope doesn't work. The seeds and bubble wrap just get crushed in the machines.

Require delivery confirmation on the packages going both ways. That way you have a way to confirm if someone really mailed their package or not and might have a better chance of finding a lost package.

USPS will send you free flat-rate Priority boxes or padded envelopes mailed directly to your house. They usually cost around $6 to mail but include a free box/envelope, tracking/delivery confirmation, and faster delivery. It may end up costing a dollar or two more than sending First Class (postage, cost of envelope, delivery confirmation) for small packages but can be the same or cheaper for larger/heavier packages. It is also easier, especially on the host who is juggling many packages. It can also help with finding lost packages. One year an entire mail bag of Piggy Swap seeds got lost in the postal system. Because the host had all of the Priority tracking numbers and kept calling the post office daily, they were able to track the bag down and get the packages delivered.
https://store.usps.com/store/b...

Participants need to bag up and label each trade of seeds individually before they send it to the host. It would be cruel to expect someone to divide up and label a thousand packs of seeds. (yes, it can be thousands in a good trade!)

If participants are sending more than one pack of seeds to another participant, they need to have a larger baggie or envelope and gather all of the seeds going to that person in one baggie/envelope and label it: who it's going to, who it's from, and how many packs. (If only sending one pack you can still do this or put the same info on the individual pack.)

Such as:

To: Dave
Total Packs = 12
(from Danita)

I typed this up for another trade but though it might be helpful here...

Pack Up Your Individual Packs of Seed

Use small plastic baggies, paper envelopes, etc. but be sure that whatever you use is secure and doesn't allow seeds to wriggle out of small cracks. (The little craft/bead baggies that they sell at Walmart or on Amazon are easy & cheap. )

Some general labeling notes:
Sharpie marker on plastic bags rubs off and smudges. By the time people receive the seed, they may no longer be able to read it.
Be sure labels are inside baggies or securely attached.

Label each individual Seed Packet with :

1) Plant's Name (both scientific & common is preferred, if known. Scientific is better than common.)
2) Year the seed was collected or purchased if it's commercial
3) Source - commercial or garden collected
4) Including your "username" is preferred

Example:
________

Salvia coccinea 'Coral Nymph'
Texas Sage
2014 commercial
(from Danita)
________

Feel free to include sowing directions or any other useful information, but it's not required.

___________________________

I have to do some other stuff now, but can add more info later. Hopefully, other group trade veterans can help with info & experiences, too.

Edit: I see I've cross-posted with Rick so already have some veteran info & experience! I'll have to read what he wrote and see if he got everything right or not. (just joking)

>> all requests would be made within the designated time period; say, two weeks.

Maybe that would be long enough if everyone's database was set up and running several weeks or months before the start time.

Thus people would need to have heard about it and put in considerable work before the start time.

And that might be the best way to go, especially for the first few swaps, while the central person or people discover what works best and what takes too much work.

But probably people will hear about it while it's running, want to join, then only have time to list very few items before the swap-time is over. Why not allow the search-and-trade time to go for a month or two?

Or, once the databases are set up, allow them to stay up indefinitely, and allow requests, new offers and trades to be added and saved over a period of months.

Then, go through the central work of send-em-all-in and mail-em-all-back-out 2 or 3 times per year. That way, the word of mouth will spread and people can join up over a long period of time.

Say you set the main deadline for January 15 to please winter-sowers and early Southern sowers. Maybe announce that one is "focused on" flowers or perennials but allows veggies. That has to be late enough for seed-savers to have harvested, dried well, divided and labeled. You don't know how many packets to promise until after you've cleaned and divided the harvest.

Why not set another date in late February or March, focused on veggies but allowing flowers?

I suppose that should depend on how much interest was expressed - or how many new trades have been agreed to since Jan 15.

I see that Danita already suggested bagging together multiple trades going to the same person. Like a "To Whom Baggy".

>> I copied and pasted the list from each post to a master list. The seeds were all mailed to me including a bubble envie inside with their address already written on the front. I dumped all the seeds in a pile then made individual place cards for each person participating. I then sorted the seeds out via each person's request from the master list.

You did a LOT of work!

I liked this method of preparing for Ella's Piggy Swap as a member, not the central person:

1. Set aside one sandwich baggy for each person I agreed to send seeds to.
2. Keep a list in a document of what seeds I have OUTGOING, sorted by who they are going TO.
3. When the trading period is over, I print my OUTGOING TRADES doc.
4. I cut it into slices, one slice for each person I'm sending TO. (It should also say "From RickCorey")
5. Each slice goes into one baggy, and I prop it up in a 4" pot.
6. Now I fill each "person" baggy from my Stash.

That takes time, but it goes faster if I have one list sorted by seed type but with recipient people's names too.

Then I can get one big bundle of Seed #1 out of my stash, and deal individual seed packets out to each baggy that needs one.
Then repeat for Seed Type #2. repeat for each outgoing seed type.

(There's some extra documentation work that way, but I only have to dig into my main stash ONCE for each seed type, and the "dealing them out" part goes really fast. If I have enough seeds to meet every trade, and they are all pre-divided, that goes REALLY fast.)

(I pre-divide my big seed stashes as soon as I buy them, or when collected seeds are good and dry. The size of an individual trade is about what I plant each time, so I like to have sowing-sized packets ready.)

7. After I do that for every seed type, I double-check by looking at each "person baggy" and its printed "slice" of owed seeds.
Then I correct any misses or other errors from dealing out the seeds.

The result is a bunch of sandwich baggies, one for each person, with that person's name in large print, visible through the baggy.
Then Ella could just take each baggy out of my mailer, read the person's name, and throw my baggy into their bucket.

Bonehead said:To 'work around' the international issue, perhaps if there is enough interest it could be divied up into US, Canada, Europe, etc. with a facilitator for each region.

Any Canadians wishing to swap seeds could go to under Canadian Seed Exchange
as Nicky is running a swap for the 5 th year. (Otherwise someone needs to get a phytosanitary certificate to import seeds into USA don't they?)

The idea is we do this here at ATP rather than sending our members to a different website.

Then someone from ATP would need to send the non USA contiributors a phytosanitary certificate. At least that is how NARGS does the swap so it is International.

The proposal was that different countries would do an exchange for their own country.

DogsNDaylilies said:LoL, Jay! I had gotten to thinking of taking on the craziness the first year to get it going and so that I could see what obstacles come up for the 'warehouse' person so that I could devise ways to fix it for the future. If you really wanted to do it the first year, though, that might work out. I'm in the middle of communicating with Dave about some of the behind-the-scene details. If I end up feeling pretty confident about it when all is said and done, I'll hand off the responsibility to you (assuming you still want it).

I have participated in the HogWild Swap on Cubits several time and have a pretty good grasp of how to do it I don't see any major obstacles for the warehouse other than getting participants to follow the guidelines and shipping in a timely manner. It wouldn't be difficult to set up the swap here or handling it on the warehouse part. I believe there is a lot of overthinking going on.